From: kijikun	Date: November 13th, 2007 02:09 am (UTC)		(Link)

Okay the bottle water thing? Partly bullshit. Yeah the bottles can create waste (recycle biatches!), but 'just tap water'. Didn't snopes debunk something like that? I know Aquafina's water is purfied 'tap water', but things that claim to be 'spring water' are from those sources. Aquafina and others that use public water sources have to say so on the label.

I'm going to keep drinking bottle water and refilling my bottles (you buy the big containers and fill up your old bottles, and hey you can put tea or whatever in those bottles too. Having a picnic freeze a bottle of water and put it in the cooler, better than a ice pack), thank you very much.

Plus a lot of peoples tap water isn't very drinkable.
/rant

	From: mamapduck	Date: November 13th, 2007 02:36 am (UTC)		(Link)

Also, the "shipped halfway around the world from third-world countries" bit? PURLEEZE!

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 02:45 am (UTC)		(Link)

Not as far fetch as you think.

"Another example of water marketing through supertankers is from Turkey to Israel. Israel will be buying (for the next twenty years) 50 million cubic meters of water annually from Turkey. The water will be extracted from the Manavgat River. The Manavgat River can export 180 mcm of water using tankers."

And that's the bulk version. Bottled water is shipped all over the place like any other product.

	From: mamapduck	Date: November 13th, 2007 05:40 am (UTC)		(Link)

And that quote is from? It doesn't apply to the situation here, but even if it did, it would need a respectable citation before it was reasonable to consider it.

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 05:57 am (UTC)		(Link)

Part of the database at the University of Michigan from 2004. Finding the original pages is a pain, they moved all the files around on the server database so most links are broken, search engines pull up chunks at a time depending on the string used. Overviews are on the Water for Life project. True to form for universities some parts are faculty and students only.

Bulk water exports/imports are being written into international trade agreements now and have been since the 90's but there is little oversight or international law being applied. Mr. Bush, the bastard, calls our water resources a service.

	From: mamapduck	Date: November 13th, 2007 07:02 am (UTC)		(Link)

So no citation.

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 07:09 pm (UTC)		(Link)

Well if that's going to be your attitude chew on some stats for awhile:

http://comtrade.un.org/db/ce/ceSnapshot.aspx?px=H1&cc=2201
http://comtrade.un.org/db/ce/ceSnapshot.aspx?px=H1&cc=220110
http://comtrade.un.org/db/ce/ceSnapshot.aspx?px=H1&cc=220190
http://comtrade.un.org/db/ce/ceSnapshot.aspx?px=H2&cc=285100

"PURLEEZE!"

	From: mamapduck	Date: November 13th, 2007 07:37 pm (UTC)		(Link)

There's no data at those links. Sorry if asking you to back up your claims is an "attitude". Where I come it's simply how one maintains credibility. I don't see any point in continuing this. You have your opinions and you're welcome to them.

	From: evilbearhunter	Date: November 13th, 2007 02:45 am (UTC)		(Link)

Hi! Water in water bottles is about 40% filtered tap water (something you can do yourself with a filter). Much of the rest comes from third world countries, again filtered. I understand that lots of people don't have access to drinkable water (by which I assume you mean water that is actually undrinkable, not water that just tastes funny), but lots of people who do choose to buy bottled water. More information here.

	From: kijikun	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:00 am (UTC)		(Link)

Yeah, still not buying it. Because when they say the water is from the springs in the french alps or from Fiji aristain wells? They have to be from those places, other wise they'd be made like Aquafina to state what they were.

I don't think you understand the difference between spring water, aristisn well water, and water like Aquafina. Plus it isn't 'tap water' if it has been filtered.

If I want bottle water, I will buy bottled water. I happen to LIKE my Fiji water, when I can afford it, and my tap water tastes like shit unless I put it in a bottle and keep it in the fridge for a few days. Filter systems can be expenive, don't always work, and often don't work with a person sitution. And guess what a lot of people that buy bottle water from soda machines would probably buy a soda if the water wasn't there.

	From: evilbearhunter	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:09 am (UTC)		(Link)

I haven't been stating this clearly, I'm sorry. There are issues with both sources. The water that is sourced from local tap water is just filtered tap water. In fact, the government standards for bottled water quality are lower than those for tap water. In this case, the issue is that bottled water is of equal or lower quality than tap water. The other source is water from other countries. Here is an example of how corporations are using water in India, but the issue is the same in other parts of the world. For the reasons explained on that page, that's also really bad.

I can't make your choices for you. A lot of people aren't aware of the issues around bottled water. If you want to take those issues into account and then buy bottled water anyway, I can't stop you. (I mean that less snottily, sorry.) I'm just trying to raise awareness about the problems with bottled water.

Cleo, just let us know if you want us to take this discussion elsewhere. I don't want to take over your comments section.

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:14 am (UTC)		(Link)

Given that Canada got screwed over by the U.S. in NAFTA over the word choices for bulk water exports this topic is extra touchy up here.

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 02:51 am (UTC)		(Link)

Google around and you find facts that say otherwise.
The Aquafina label issue is a recent court ruling; they were busted by consumers for something government regulation allowed.
Spring water sources are pressure pumped bore hole wells next to springs allowed under current regs and have their own issues.
Undrinkable tap water in urban centers is an issue of wimpy taste buds and cheap old plumbing not safety.
Recycling is not a solution for overconsumption.

	From: kijikun	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:06 am (UTC)		(Link)

Aquafina and others that use public water sources have to say so on the label.

Uhm yeah, did you not see the part about Aquafina having to say it same that the water came from public water sources?

Okay Cleo freeze me please before I wind up on oft_wank?

	From: lyrainverse	Date: November 13th, 2007 06:32 am (UTC)		(Link)

Do you have the source saying that this is mandatory? So far I've only been able to find things that say it's a voluntary measure- Dasani, owned by Coca-Cola, is also mostly tap water but they're not planning to change their label. Also, from what I've found, Pepsi hasn't set a deadline for when they're going to label their water, so if there's no regulations behind it, I'm guessing they'll drag their feet on it until people just forget about it.

Mostly I think it's hilarious, because it just goes to show how easily people can be sold on something. It reminds me of the episode of Golden Girls when Sophia gives the ladies a glass of water and when they all exclaim about how good it is, she says "It's from the hose out back! I'm gonna bottle it and make millions!"

Mmmm hose water.

	From: dancingxstar	Date: November 13th, 2007 07:39 am (UTC)		(Link)

I don't know how people can drink that stuff, to be honest. Maybe it's because I grew up on well water, but "bottled water" tastes of tap water with added crap, to me. Some spring water is drinkable, and I can do tap water if it's filtered and very cold, but ugh.

	From: fiveforsilver	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:33 am (UTC)		(Link)

I agree on most counts, but you've clearly never had the tap water in New Hampshire. It's disgusting, and it doesn't matter if you have old plumbing or new. I don't know anyone who doesn't use bottled water or some kind of filtration system - I have a Brita pitcher in the fridge. I just moved here, but even people who grew up in the area don't drink the tap water.

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:45 am (UTC)		(Link)

I alternate between locations in which the tap water can dissolve your teeth and another that leaves plaster on your teeth. Days when it smells like a swimming pool and others when it looks like the aquarium bottom, oy sulfur. The local utilities providers are not going to be motivated to improve the water delivery if everyone just goes alternate routes and hands their money over to for profit corporations buying bottled. The money spent on bottle water and filters could collectively easily upgrade most systems. People bitched about and rejected an annual tax increase of about $200 that would have made our system state of the art but will spend that much a month on bottled.

	From: fiveforsilver	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:53 am (UTC)		(Link)

I don't spend it on bottled water, and I do (or would, anyway) support a tax like that. On the other hand, people will always find something to spend money on that other people thing is frivolous, bad for the environment, etc.

And until the water system in my area is upgraded (I don't even know if it's being considered) or I move, I will continue buying the Brita filters, because I like to actually be able to drink water without feeling ill.

	From: sucrelefey	Date: November 13th, 2007 04:03 am (UTC)		(Link)

My only objection to the Brita filters and others is that they are disposable not reusable or recycling and overpriced for what they are, lesser of evils for some I guess.
Usana used to have a home model counter top distiller now that would be pure and safe.

	From: sapphires13	Date: November 13th, 2007 05:44 am (UTC)		(Link)

=/ I feel bad for you folks who have yucky tap water. The water here is perfect, and I actually prefer it over bottled water. To me, bottled water has always tasted flat, or else it tastes like the plastic bottle it's in. There is a convenience factor to having water in a bottle, but then again, I have a reuseable sports bottle that matches my track pants, so I just use that.

In conclusion, yeah, you should all move here. The water comes from the Ohio river, and I wouldn't swim in it, but by the time it gets to my kitchen it's been treated to perfect deliciousness =)

	From: cleolinda	Date: November 13th, 2007 05:59 am (UTC)		(Link)

Yeah, Birmingham also has tasty, tasty water.

	From: lyrainverse	Date: November 13th, 2007 06:22 am (UTC)		(Link)

Awesome icon! Reason #238148 why Kentucky is Superior: Great-tasting water.

	From: singeaddams	Date: November 13th, 2007 07:10 am (UTC)		(Link)

Minneapolis has the good stuff, too! (From the Mississippi river and filtered to within an inch of its life.) Love it.

	From: lotusbiosm	Date: November 13th, 2007 03:30 pm (UTC)		(Link)

By law, tap water has to be safe for consumption. That's not to say that I didn't immediately buy a Brita for my DC tap, but I know that I can drink it and it won't make me sick. It might not taste great, but it is safe.
Also, those bottles aren't really meant for reuse. We all do it, but there is some speculation/evidence that reuse isn't really a fantastic idea, because the plastic leeches chemicals into the water.
What I do is carry a Camelback bottle that I fill up at work.